"Politically correct"

RedEyedAbyss

Is it just me, or is the term most often used to mean "Don't talk to me about race/gender/class/etc. issues because I don't care and you shouldn't either"? I guess I have observed a lot of cases in which such language adjustment comes off as whitesplaining, but generally I see the phrase used in such a dismissive manner that I can't help but suspect a thought-terminating cliche at work.

BlackHumor

"Politically correct" is how assholes refer to what everyone else calls "being nice".

DonZabu

George Carlin talks about how "Poor people used to live in slums. Now the economically disadvantaged occupy substandard housing in the inner-city."

I have yet to hear anyone say the latter, and I also have to hear anyone get hassled for saying the former.

RedEyedAbyss

Well, he does think there's nothing wrong with the N word apparently.

Ironweaver

Most terms that are a product of political correctness are frankly quite ridiculous, and are often used to replace terms that nobody would find offensive in the first place. Avoiding to say what most people would consider offensive already falls under basic decency. If anything, the PC movement makes liberals look ridiculous to everyone else, like pretty much all mainstream political forces in the US weren't ridiculous enough. It's very interesting to note that a lot of early campaigners for tolerance, who unwillingly paved the way for the whole thing, claim that political correctness is stupid and inane and that they didn't fight for that.

Nova

I have yet to hear anyone say the latter, and I also have to hear anyone get hassled for saying the former.

I have yet to hear anyone tell me why people shouldn't say "African-American" as opposed to "Black" or "Nigger".

Well, apart from "It's stupid!". Which isn't a very good reason.

Ironweaver

"African-American" stops making sense outside of the American continent. You can't use it to refer to a black person from Africa, and I'd imagine that they wouldn't like it.

Crimson

^^I've met black people who prefer the term black because they believe their history and heritage lies in America, not Africa.

^That too.

Malkavian

Not all black people are from Africa. Not all black people are in America. Simple as that.

MillerCross

I also never understood why the term black is seen as offensive. I understand nigger, because of sociohistorical connotations, but not "black"

Icalasari

Also, a white person can be African American

RedEyedAbyss

^^I think this is a case of white people projecting offense to the word.

MillerCross

Also, a white person can be African American

Well, only if you take the word literally. But you do have a point.

^^I think this is a case of white people projecting offense to the word.

Yeah, figured as much, really. 

My whole problem may be the fact that most black people are not really black, but brown, but whatever, it doesn't really matter.

glennmagusharvey

And that's why I think you should use colors to refer to people's race--which is determined by their skin color anyway.  So we have whites, blacks, reds, yellows, browns, and tans.  Maybe some beiges or something.

If you want to actually talk about one's cultural heritage, then let's start specifying more geographical detail.

Ironweaver

^^^ Which is the basis of the whole PC movement, really. Overprivileged political activists trying to figure out what do those less fortunate than them find offensive, without even, y'know, asking them.

Ironweaver

Bluh, double post

glennmagusharvey

The thing here though is that it's harder for people to have immediate emotional reactions to phrases with more syllables.  So in that sense, phrases with more syllables are more likely to allow people to keep their cool.

Wicked223

Here's the funny thing: No serious left-wing activist has ever, at any point in time, used the term "political correctness" to describe what they're trying to achieve. Ever. The truth is, 'political correctness' is a term brought to prominence by the American right and used solely and completely by in that same circle, in order to make any attempts to make mainstream society more hospitable to anyone who isn't a SAWCSM seem like some vast left-wing conspiracy. (god that was a long sentence)

In fact, if you could find any example of people on the left using the term, I'd be very grateful, because all this harping on PC-ness as some totalitarian cultural force is really, really fucking annoying.

CountryPumpkin

I mostly agree with this guy ^ up here, but there have been a few isolated incidents, such as the time a man in the Oklahoma state legislature was criticized for using the term "black holes" and not a more racially-neutral term. Of course, those types of incidents are conflated by the right as a WAR ON CHRISTMAS or whatever they're harping on this week.

Alkthash

Besides, the world's worst slur isn't even English.

What does that have to do with anything in the conversation right now?

InsanityAddict

The niggardly controversy also springs to mind.

CountryPumpkin

What does that have to do with anything in the conversation right now?

Sorry, I was getting my Internet message boards mixed up there.

Nova

"African-American" stops making sense outside of the American continent. You can't use it to refer to a black person from Africa, and I'd imagine that they wouldn't like it.

No, I'm not talking about that, is the thing. Purely in an American context, where people use 'black' to refer to, well, african americans or whoever. The label is equally as innacurate, because there are a lot of black people who aren't of that ethnicity. Take Australian Aboriginals- I doubt anyone in America means to refer to them when they say 'black people', but they're kind of black people too.

also, wow, never post and then go off to watch people in rubber suits beat up rubber monsters for long, you end up having to read too much

MadassAlex

Ethnicity is a load of fuck in any case. It's not 100% irrelevant -- that would be colour blindness -- but we draw different distinctions depending on context. The Chinese have fifty-five or so legally recognised Asian minorities, the Middle East has two main ethnic groups (at least) and Europe has three that all come under the heading of "white". First Nationer ethnicity is also a load of fuck, since the line could be drawn by region or tribe. 

And then, le wild South America, which is Native American meets Spanish, which is in itself Germanic, African and Arabic in combination. 

There are just points at which it gets kind of ridiculous and the lines we draw begin to lose meaning. Which is all well and good from an objective point of view, but the lines we draw have wider social meaning until racial discrimination can be removed from matters of law, state and social relations. 

Given that race is more of a construct than an actual objective thing, many of its elements are going to be subjective. This doesn't justify the use of terms such as "nigger" or "spick", but it means that non-offensive terminology will be inconsistent. I don't think there's a "right" choice between African-American and black as terms.

MillerCross

And then, le wild South America

revolvers at high noon, mister.

MadassAlex

no

swords at dawn

MillerCross

but...that's unfair

Crimson

You used rage comic speak Alex. You don't get to choose the terms.

Nova

it's a french word though

MadassAlex

^^^ you have six weeks and four days to train, as written in both Talhoffer's combat manuals and Dragonball Z. 

MillerCross

it's a french word though

but it's a french word used in an english context. it's all kinds of wrong

it's kinda like calling you La Australiana. 

^^^ you have six weeks and four days to train, as written in both Talhoffer's combat manuals and Dragonball Z.

where will i get a sensei