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IJBM II's One Year Anniversary
Yeah, I realize that it will actually be four days until the one year anniversary of IJBM's deletion/the creation of IJBM II, but I figured that it might be worth it to start talking about now.
Anyway, it has been about a year and I am interested to hear about other people's impressions of that year and how things have changed since the deletion of IJBM. I do not really have much else to add, so I guess I might as well make this some kind of questionnaire. It is probably a good idea to keep in mind that some of the TV Tropes stuff is borderline so please try to avoid insulting individual tropers or otherwise importing drama.
On IJBM:
- Were you active in IJBM prior to its deletion? If so, what did you like/dislike the most about it?
- Before IJBM's deletion was announced, did you think that subforum would ever be axed?
- Do you think IJBM's deletion made sense?
- Do you have any good/bad memories of IJBM post-deletion announcement (especially its last few hours)?
- In your view, has IJBM's deletion affected TV Tropes? Would TV Tropes be better or worse if IJBM became a subforum again?
- How have your posting habits/view of TV Tropes changed since IJBM's deletion?
On IJBM II:
- Did you ever envision something like IJBM II after IJBM's end was announced?
- Are you surprised that IJBM II is still around?
- Are you surprised that you are still posting on IJBM II? What keeps you coming back?
- What are your favorite/least favorite aspects of IJBM II, especially in comparison to IJBM?
- How well do you believe IJBM II has captured the spirit of the original IJBM? Should it be similar or were there problems with IJBM that IJBM II has solved?
- If IJBM had been moderated and treated like IJBM II, do you think it would still be on TV Tropes today?
- What do you think is the most important factor for keeping IJBM II alive in the future?
Comments
Part 2:
Definitely not.
It was, as said, the start of the NO COMPLAINING EVER shit, which was dumb (especially as they outright said they didn't plan on doing that when they first announced the deletion).
I post there substantially less; I hadn't really noticed that I was posting almost entirely in IJBM, but I was.
I expected it to happen; I didn't expect it to be successful.
Not really, small forums with small communities can last a long time. I've had lots of experience with that.
Not surprised, I come back for the community, I guess, or just because I have nowhere better to post.
Having sane mods is nice, and less trolls on account of not being attached to a larger forum.
Eh, it's close enough as far as I can see. It's not all complaining anymore, but that's probably okay.
Most of the TV Tropes mods seem to be convinced that this place is a poorly-moderated shithole (to which I say look who's talking), but whether that's based on having ever actually checked I can't say.
I dunno.
Yup. That was even before I was Forzare. I liked it, but I can't really remember specific reasons why. I don't even remember my posting style from then or how I came across.
>>Before IJBM's deletion was announced, did you think that subforum would ever be axed?
Not really.
>>Do you think IJBM's deletion made sense?
Not really. Especially since the stupidity just moved to OTC, from what I've seen.
>>Do you have any good/bad memories of IJBM post-deletion announcement (especially its last few hours)?
Nope. I pretty much just stopped posting there when I heard, since it was going to be gone anyway.
>>In your view, has IJBM's deletion affected TV Tropes? Would TV Tropes be better or worse if IJBM became a subforum again?
I don't really pay enough attention to TV Tropes as a whole to really judge. Though it was the herald of the "Negativity = inherently bad" thing, and seriously fuck that. I'm kind of glad it's separate now, though.
>>How have your posting habits/view of TV Tropes changed since IJBM's deletion?
I think I've become much calmer since I've been posting here. Much less shit-posty. Also, I dislike the TV Tropes. I still sort of like the wiki, for what it is, but it's definitely not what it really says it is.
On IJBM II:
>>Did you ever envision something like IJBM II after IJBM's end was announced?
Not really.
>>Are you surprised that IJBM II is still around?
Kind of, yeah. I didn't join until like five months later because I thought it would suck.
>>Are you surprised that you are still posting on IJBM II? Why keeps you coming back?
Well, I've lasted longer here than I have on any other forum without getting bored or whatever and leaving. I do like most of the people here, though, and I like the smaller, more familiar atmosphere here.
>>What are your favorite/least favorite aspects of IJBM II, especially in comparison to IJBM?
Until recently, I would have said the inability of the mods to just ban certain users who had no business not being banned here. That's pretty much resolved now, though, so I'll go with the site being a bit too small.
>>How well do you believe IJBM II has captured the spirit of the original IJBM?
I dunno. I like it the way it is, though.
>>Should it be similar or were there problems with IJBM that IJBM II has solved?
I think it's better here than it was on TVT. Especially since we haven't had a real shitstorm in forever.
>>If IJBM had been moderated and treated like IJBM II, do you think it would still be on TV Tropes today?
Nah.
>>What do you think is the most important factor for keeping IJBM II alive in the future?
We need more members. I actually kind of like that the site is small, but we do need new blood now and then so it doesn't just waste away.
Yes. I liked how it was a place that hosted both serious and silly topics, so that people would come for one and come in contact with the other, encouraging a more diverse set of viewpoints.
* Before IJBM's deletion was announced, did you think that subforum would ever be axed?
I did. I was always surprised that a subforum for complaining about things--especially an easily-accessible subforum of a major website with high forum traffic and an easy account creation process--had lasted that long.
* Do you think IJBM's deletion made sense?
It did in the sense that it removed a moderation nightmare. I mean, it was a place where basically anyone and everyone had airtime to bitch about anything, no matter how big or small; without sufficient moderation keeping stupid emotional reactions (e.g. RAEG) in check, this is guaranteed to be a drama fountain.
* Do you have any good/bad memories of IJBM post-deletion announcement (especially its last few hours)?
Apart from the extremely silly threads I made (such as "Stealth Rock", where I just plastered the first post with a large number of controversial topics...only for people to actually discuss Stealth Rock afterwards), it was very much cluttered with pointlessness. And I'm pretty sure it was a big strain on the servers. Not that it came as a surprise; I totally expected IJBM 1 to go out with as chaotic and shitposty a mess as possible.
* In your view, has IJBM's deletion affected TV Tropes? Would TV Tropes be better or worse if IJBM became a subforum again?
I think it probably cleaned up the forum a bit, making it more like what (based on my understanding) Fast Eddie wanted it to be, which is basically a place for the TV Tropes community to supplement the wiki. I know there are criticisms of the site and the forum unnecessarily quashing dissent and avoiding drama by gag orders, but adding IJBM back won't solve those problems.
* How have your posting habits/view of TV Tropes changed since IJBM's deletion?
I've spent less time on TVTF mostly because I now have IJBM to manage.
----
* Did you ever envision something like IJBM II after IJBM's end was announced?
I was one of the first people to propose IJBM 2, in fact; several PMs and "ghost threads" were exchanged privately to help set this up.
Then I was made administrator of this forum. I was like, wait what? Then I realized I'd been too darn involved in the first place and I had this coming.
* Are you surprised that IJBM II is still around?
Not really.
* Are you surprised that you are still posting on IJBM II? Why keeps you coming back?
I'm not surprised; I'm one of the people running the darn place, and I kinda have a responsibility to not neglect it. That's not to say I don't enjoy posting here, though.
* What are your favorite/least favorite aspects of IJBM II, especially in comparison to IJBM?
I like how it preserves a simple interface like the TVTF version of IJBM. We host no pictures or other non-text content except for avatars, and we don't have a space for signatures (much less huge banner sigs), and we keep things simple and focused on the content.
We also have some software bugs, but we'll sort those out as time goes on.
* How well do you believe IJBM II has captured the spirit of the original IJBM? Should it be similar or were there problems with IJBM that IJBM II has solved?
I would like to think that we have a more engaged moderation staff that's attentive to the needs of the community, and that has made IJBM 2 a better place to both unwind casually and discuss things seriously. What do you think?
* If IJBM had been moderated and treated like IJBM II, do you think it would still be on TV Tropes today?
I really don't know.
* What do you think is the most important factor for keeping IJBM II alive in the future?
Maintaining an atmosphere and interface suited for casual discussion of any topic, by doing our best to keep the website running smoothly and the community relatively free of drama and other problems.
While you're at it, might as well as that question: What is the most embarrassing thing you have seen/typed/heard from here?
On IJBM II:
- Did you ever envision something like IJBM II after IJBM's end was announced?
- To be honest, no. I panicked because I would have nowhere else to turn to. Then this place showed up, and I came the very next day once I saw many familiar faces.
- Are you surprised that IJBM II is still around?
- No, because WE ARE AWESOME.
- Are you surprised that you are still posting on IJBM II? Why keeps you coming back?
- I like most people here, and the few I don't like I have at least a begrudging respect for sticking around here. I have come to think of everyone here as brothers; though we may not always get along, we are still kindred spirits with a bond that is not easily forged.
- What are your favorite/least favorite aspects of IJBM II, especially in comparison to IJBM?
- At first, I liked the fact we got to continue bitching without the prying eyes of the TvT administration, but eventually we evolved to doing other things like IJAM, roleplaying (not my thing participating but I like reading them from time to time) and even wonderful posts where we can go insane and others understand, it's like a sign saying "Not serious you guys". Plus, now that I'm a moderator I can really appreciate the fact this place moves at a speed I'm comfortable with, like leave for a few hours and can quickly catch up the the day's posts.
- How
- I think we have been able to endure for so long is BECAUSE we are almost nothing like the first IJBM, in the same way the AVALANCHE you see in Final Fantasy VII is nothing like the AVALANCHE in like Before Crisis or Crisis core. For example, only the people who actually cared came here to make accounts and we all generally get along for the most part. We still do the same stuff we used to, only better and with many more options.
- If IJBM had been moderated and treated like IJBM II, do you think it would still be on TV Tropes today?
- No. Their official stance is "no negativity", and there is absolutely no possibility we could have been allowed to stay with that kind of stance.
- What do you think is the most important factor for keeping IJBM II alive in the future?
- The ironic thing is that more people from TvT are finding out about
But ultimately, the reason this place is still around is because of YOU GUYS. YOU GUYS make all this possible, YOU GUYS keep this place thriving. This place could not come around because of YOU GUYS. Never forget that.well do you believe IJBM II has captured the spirit of the original
IJBM? Should it be similar or were there problems with IJBM that IJBM II
has solved?
this place and, AMAZINGLY, would rather hang out HERE rather than Yack
Fest or the disease festival we call OTC, which has almost become like
the new bane of the website where people go to complain, except the On-Topic rule means people flaunt their opinions at each other with no comprehension or understanding of tolerance or respect towards one another, so basically what I'm say is...they can suck it.
On IJBM:
Yes I was. I liked that with the thread turnover it had, it was difficult not to find a discussion about whatever topic interested me.
Since I wasn't very suprised, I guess deep inside I did think the possibility was there, though I didn't think Eddie would actually do it until he made the announcement.
I think fixing it was a completely viable alternative, although I guess it might have taken more effort that the mods (who, throughout the time I've been there, I've thought they're overburdened) would be willing to put.
The unbridled shitposting was something to behold. Also, people taking its deletion with acceptance (if also with disappointment) was a nice sight, if eerie.
Yes, it has affected TV Tropes. OTC inherited the worst aspects of IJBM1 (people with horrible views and the atmosphere surrounding serious topics, both things got even worse than they were), and none of the good ones (the more casual atmosphere to dampen them).
Since the only thing I'd expect if it were to become a subforum again is that loads of new users would flock to it, I have no idea how it'd look like or what it'd do to the site at large, so...
Although I actually tried to maintain activity on there, few of the Yack Fest topics interested me, thus I stopped checking the subforum and ended up following only certain megathreads (the Spanish thread and the Touhou Games thread, and for a while the main Touhou thread, the "Entries that made you wut" thread, the straight men thread, and the Japanese thread while it lasted).
I also stopped going to OTC and IJAM not long after the deletion.
Interestingly, I've been somewhat active there since Christmas.
On IJBM II:
I envisioned somebody starting a PHP forum, getting like 4 members and becoming desolate after a week.For a long while I was. I stopped being surprised around the 8 months mark.
Other than it being still around, it's not surprising that I still post here, as I was obsessed with it since before its deletion.
What keeps making me coming back is the community, you weirdos are fun to hang around with.
As much as I like watching a good one, its tendency to have shitstorms is unbecoming of such a small forum.
Comparing it to IJBM I, the relative lack of activity can be disheartening at times.
For the first months I saw IJBM II just like I did the old one except on a smaller scale, so I guess the answer to the spirit thing is probably "yes". This is if we're talking about IJBM I not long before its deletion, as what the spirit of IJBM is had changed over time, if you ask me.
Anyhow, now that IJBM II is more like a community site the "complaint" element doesn't feel like it's there, and now topics related to TV Tropes aren't common or something almost all our users engage in, it doesn't feel like a community parallel to it (even though both elements are very clearly there).
Problems solved? Ehh, I dunno. I guess I'll choose banning certain specific posters.
IJBM II had serious moderation issues during its first months (no offense), so I guess that automatically makes the answer "no". Either way one thing I've learned here is how big the difference between moderating small and large forums is (and how the former isn't necessarily easier), so I guess that's another strike.
Now, if an appropriate moderation team had magically appeared (what with Fast Eddie being reluctant to appoint moderators), there's still the "complaining" element that Fast Eddie abhors, so I guess even given all the above, the answer is still a "probably not".
I suppose a good reason for new users to join.